The New York Times just ran a piece by David Brooks which went on from an overview of history. Basically Abbie Hoffman, and Herr Trump are the same. My old comrades of the far left...even middle left went apoplectic over this. "How dare they..." sort of stuff. Nothing like pissing on a cult saint to bring out the parishioners.
Stepping back, and putting whatever cult bubble we're stuck in aside. Yeah these two figures Abbie, and Donny are alike.
I think this will be more apparent many generations from now. This when those that lived through the cultures wars are gone. ...eh, that's us. Then historians will see things not clouded with emotions of the current eras.
Both of these persons were wild cards with no concept of the true effect of their behavior. One from the Reagan leisure class one from the idealistic Kennedy era. Both throwing wrenches into the body politic with no clear understanding of the effect, and on the whole different degrees with each not caring.
Before you reflexively start which is what social platforms encourage...this is what them Russian Bots were so good at during the election. Putting that aside if possible. Remember I said that it would take "generations" for these characters to be seen by most as similar.
I'm old enough finally to see the little worlds we inhabit, and think it's the universe.
Ya know if ya lucky you might get old too!
On the other pages where I posted a version of this. My comrades seemed incapable of transcending their partician views. That is it seems difficult for some to see beyond the past or present. They're trapped in an eternal now, and how they feel now.
I had to repeat several times I was speaking about how future generations would see these two cultural wildcard figures. All they could do was say how great Abbie was, and how evil Trump is. Not getting the larger historic arc I was trying to illustrate.
These guys represent the same radical impulses of the American culture expressed in profoundly different ways.
My commie comrades, and several rightwing pals both get an F- on transcending historic place. They being a bit stuck in their territorial bubbles.. Hey I ain't so damned smart, but I see where this is going. Thank you,...my t-shirts weird hats, and CDs are at the back of the hall. I'll be here all weekend tell ya friends.
Now from the comments my explanation of this apparently inexplicable to many post.
( This from my dear comrade fan of this page "Anonymous".)
Anonymous said...
Certainly they were/are both kultural/media klowns. But you do seem to ignore one small fact: one became president of the United States while the other disappeared into obscurity.
I've run into the same point on FB. Here's my ten times longer that the original post explanation which was originally posted in Facebook..
*My weary reply:
Well it seems that some are reluctant to transcend their partician views. That is it seems difficult for some to see beyond the past or present. They're trapped in an eternal now, and how they feel now. I'm talking the arc of history.
What the future will see of all this.
I had to repeat several times on other pages I was speaking about how future generations would see these two cultural wildcard figures. Abbie, and Donny. All they could do was say how great Abbie was, and how evil Trump is. Not getting the larger historic arc I was trying to illustrate.
These guys represent the same radical impulses of the American culture expressed in profoundly different ways. Abbie for example wasn't president with control of the federal government. Yet he had a profound influence on a relatively small part of the nation...30%. Sound familiar. However that spilled into the general population. In that he out did the feds of that time. He changed part of our national culture.
Trump has a 30% lemming population as well.
This with also an overlap into the well of the masses of the nation. No these folks ain't exactly the same, but they represent the same radical impulse...get it. Just expressed in a seriously different way...again get it?
Think as I sez from the point of view of say folks in 2130. When all or most of the culture war survivors are gone.
Also with them the passions they refused to let go of.
That future generation will see us, and our passionate bullshit very differently. Because they will 'not' be blinded by the emotion that drowns 'reason' out of 'us'.
I mean how many out there are still outraged by the Bull Moose party or the bullshit the Wigs did?
*It goes on as my comrades didn't at all get what I was on about. All they knew was that they liked Abbie, and hated Trump. So I took another swing at it.
*Look I said,....
They both wanted radical change. They both come from the impulse of the radical nature of the American experiment...which as we know to our horror is still in progress. That Abbie was radical left, and Donny is Nazi right in immaterial.
They both sailed the same radical sea, and both may ultimately give us a monumental nation destroying disaster.
Abbie with his continuing effect now morphed beyond recognition into leftwing balkanized ethnic racial cultural identity cults, and Donny the exact same, but from the right. ...same likely disaster ahead.
Then again as you all say I could be totally wrong. The mice are the ones really in charge.
They set us up against each other while they quietly plan.
*Even this didn't work!
*This as they stood blank faced saying "Abbie was cool Trump is bad".
So I gave it one more try. That is trying to get these fucking commie cultists to see beyond their here, and now passions, and try to imagine how all this demented mayhem would look several generations from now.
Fucking dummies they just couldn't let go of their tribal culture war cultism's.
*Here we go again.
I say again. That they shared the 'same' radical impulse that has powered the American experiment. The Confederates also were powered by this. This is what makes that national radical Impulse so dangerous, but needed. Needed because it also gave energy to Dr. King's radical movement as well.
Call it American Kryptonite. Insanely powerful yet profoundly dangerous in the wrong hands.
*Yeah I got posts even after this saying, "...but Abbie was progressive how can you say he's like Trump."
Sigh....Completely totally missed the point.
I was amazed at the power of two dimensional thinking. They just 'could not' break through to see how we might look in the future. They were nailed to the present.
These were educated progressives at that.
Their adherence to their tribal sacraments saints, and rules is iron clad. They should never put down the fucking yokels for their Jesus flag, and guns crap because these arrogant commie jerks are no better.
With that I walked away.
Well okay I did looks to see if 'anyone' got my point. No. There were maybe a dozen posts saying. "This is crazy how can you say Abbie was like Trump."
There's no point.
So long as the cults of the culture wars exist we're locked into madness stupidity suspicion, and in an as yet unarmed civil war.
Now from the comments my explanation of this apparently inexplicable to many post.
( This from my dear comrade fan of this page "Anonymous".)
Anonymous said...*My weary reply:
Well it seems that some are reluctant to transcend their partician views. That is it seems difficult for some to see beyond the past or present. They're trapped in an eternal now, and how they feel now. I'm talking the arc of history.
What the future will see of all this.
I had to repeat several times on other pages I was speaking about how future generations would see these two cultural wildcard figures. Abbie, and Donny. All they could do was say how great Abbie was, and how evil Trump is. Not getting the larger historic arc I was trying to illustrate.
These guys represent the same radical impulses of the American culture expressed in profoundly different ways. Abbie for example wasn't president with control of the federal government. Yet he had a profound influence on a relatively small part of the nation...30%. Sound familiar. However that spilled into the general population. In that he out did the feds of that time. He changed part of our national culture.
Trump has a 30% lemming population as well.
This with also an overlap into the well of the masses of the nation. No these folks ain't exactly the same, but they represent the same radical impulse...get it. Just expressed in a seriously different way...again get it?
Think as I sez from the point of view of say folks in 2130. When all or most of the culture war survivors are gone.
Also with them the passions they refused to let go of.
That future generation will see us, and our passionate bullshit very differently. Because they will 'not' be blinded by the emotion that drowns 'reason' out of 'us'.
I mean how many out there are still outraged by the Bull Moose party or the bullshit the Wigs did?
*It goes on as my comrades didn't at all get what I was on about. All they knew was that they liked Abbie, and hated Trump. So I took another swing at it.
*Look I said,....
They both wanted radical change. They both come from the impulse of the radical nature of the American experiment...which as we know to our horror is still in progress. That Abbie was radical left, and Donny is Nazi right in immaterial.
They both sailed the same radical sea, and both may ultimately give us a monumental nation destroying disaster.
Abbie with his continuing effect now morphed beyond recognition into leftwing balkanized ethnic racial cultural identity cults, and Donny the exact same, but from the right. ...same likely disaster ahead.
Then again as you all say I could be totally wrong. The mice are the ones really in charge.
They set us up against each other while they quietly plan.
*Even this didn't work!
*This as they stood blank faced saying "Abbie was cool Trump is bad".
So I gave it one more try. That is trying to get these fucking commie cultists to see beyond their here, and now passions, and try to imagine how all this demented mayhem would look several generations from now.
Fucking dummies they just couldn't let go of their tribal culture war cultism's.
*Here we go again.
I say again. That they shared the 'same' radical impulse that has powered the American experiment. The Confederates also were powered by this. This is what makes that national radical Impulse so dangerous, but needed. Needed because it also gave energy to Dr. King's radical movement as well.
Call it American Kryptonite. Insanely powerful yet profoundly dangerous in the wrong hands.
*Yeah I got posts even after this saying, "...but Abbie was progressive how can you say he's like Trump."
Sigh....Completely totally missed the point.
I was amazed at the power of two dimensional thinking. They just 'could not' break through to see how we might look in the future. They were nailed to the present.
These were educated progressives at that.
Their adherence to their tribal sacraments saints, and rules is iron clad. They should never put down the fucking yokels for their Jesus flag, and guns crap because these arrogant commie jerks are no better.
With that I walked away.
Well okay I did looks to see if 'anyone' got my point. No. There were maybe a dozen posts saying. "This is crazy how can you say Abbie was like Trump."
There's no point.
So long as the cults of the culture wars exist we're locked into madness stupidity suspicion, and in an as yet unarmed civil war.
5 comments:
I don't know enough about A.H. to parse this one. I was a small kid then. But I've heard his one-time pal Jerry Rubin later said "money is the long hair of the 80s." What a turncoat!
Z
Jerry. He was always out there. Have no idea what happened to him. Likely became an Aryan terrorist while in prison.
Certainly they were/are both kultural/media klowns. But you do seem to ignore one small fact: one became president of the United States while the other disappeared into obscurity.
At the memorial service for Hoffman the following was reported by the NY TImes:
Rabbi Norman Mendell said in his eulogy that Mr. Hoffman's long history of protest, antic though much of it had been, was 'in the Jewish prophetic tradition, which is to comfort the afflicted and afflict the comfortable.
I don't know a hell of a lot about Abby, but when I saw his book at the store I didn't steal it. The man was dead so it wouldn't have harmed him, but if I am going to be a thief it will be for a better reason than to make a bad joke.
As for our current President if the Rabbi spoke for him he might say:
He spoke words of comfort to some who were afflicted, and then fucked them hard, which surprised no one but those who were fucked.
I just checked Abbie's bio in the wiki and a linked article says that in '68 he and his fellow Yippies nominated a pig for President - the Immortal Pigasus. Looks to me like their candidate finally won. The World Historical Individual, the Swine of Destiny is among us, squealing to accelerate America's final descent into the glorious wallow that awaits!
Z
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